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Jul. 8th, 2005 08:29 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
gwynI thought I'd write a little bit about the thinking behind making the new Fast and the Furious vid Loaded Gun, even though only a couple of my friends probably care. More just for my own amusement, as I said, and because I like to have my thoughts put down someplace where I can refer to them later. I'm really pleased that the people who've given it a try have enjoyed it, especially the folks for whom the movie is unfamiliar (btw -- next usage post will be on who/whom!).
I've been sitting on this song and vid idea for a year, almost exactly. It was last June that I woke up one morning and decided I was obsessed with the Fast and the Furious, after having liked the movie, but not thought too much about it, for a long time. I'd seen Chronicles of Riddick and written an essay about why I still liked Vin Diesel despite the movie (which can be found in my memories), and for some reason, it triggered some sort of latent, slash-needing, recovering from Angel being cancelled thing in me, and next thing I knew I was hoovering up fanfic and talking about vidding. This was the first song I thought of, a song that I'd wanted to vid a long, long time ago for Mulder and Skinner back in my X-Files vidding days, but I didn't think that I could do the things I wanted to on VCRs, and I'm glad I waited so long to use it. The one thing people have commented on so far the most is that the song is letter perfect for the fandom and the characters.
So, why wait so long if the song is perfect? It would seem counterintuitive, if you have the perfect song and the ability, to not make the vid. I felt really strongly then that I needed to focus on the relationship between Brian and Dom, and Loaded Gun was too... big, I guess. Too comprehensive. There was only one other vid online that I could find, Khaleesian's Never Let Me Down (which was one of the first songs I thought of when I decided I wanted to do this, but focus more on the 'ship), and I knew about Zen's cute little Speed Racer vid but that wasn't online. It seemed imperative to me that I use a song that would allow a super-tight focus, because that would be the way to appeal to people, get their interest -- sometimes, a really big, comprehensive story can overwhelm someone new to the fandom. And I knew that Loaded Gun would mean a vid that might not be as accessible to those unfamiliar with the movie.
I hunted for a song, but everything I liked, others hated, and it wasn't until![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
mlyn pimped some more Depeche Mode at me, and I heard Stripped, that I found what I wanted. So I put Loaded Gun to the side. (And here is where I rant about how sick to death I am of the nasty snipey comments about two -- count 'em, TWO! whole vids to Depeche Mode songs. The horror! Jesus H, what a burden to have two vids to two separate Depeche Mode songs. I don't hear anyone bitching about the 5,000 Highlander vids to yet another bombastic piece of crap from godawful U2, but you do the only other extant F&F vid to Depeche Mode and suddenly you've made it such a misery for all those poor people. Can you tell how sick I am of the comments about it? gah! /rant.) And I think I was on the money about that decision, because the vid really connected with a lot of people who knew nothing about the film, and sparked their interest.
In the meantime, I'd planned to go back to Loaded Gun... until all these other vids showed up. A couple of them were good, but a lot of them were just awful. And it seemed like another vid, even if it was a great one, would just be overkill. I didn't want people to feel about F&F the way I felt about Hard Core Logo, where I never wanted to see the movie (even though originally I'd wanted to) because I was so damn sick of the vids. And I still kind of worry about that, and can't help thinking that since the statistical number of hits on this new vid and requests for the PW to my site are much lower this time, that's an indicator that people are vidded out for the movie.
The hard part about acknowledging that is this time, I really tried to use stuff that hasn't been used in other vids, including my own. There's only so much you can do with a two-hour film, clip-wise, but the song afforded me a lot of chances to pull pieces of commonly used clips that weren't getting put in, or make use of sections that don't get used at all. I think that's one of the vid's great strengths, and I was pleased with how it came out in that respect, especially being able to use the deleted gay porn video cover tableau scene, which is unsweetened (meaning it wasn't processed and therefore doesn't look like the rest of the movie). I'd really hoped to color correct it, but I couldn't figure out for the life of me how to do that. So when I lit on the idea of using it subliminally, almost, in that little electronic stutter portion of the music, I was rather tickled with myself. I picked up the technique fromklia and thevetia's Touching Evil vid, Untitled 6, and followed how they edited two separate sequences -- one with a strong visual centered against a busier picture -- one frame against one frame, then paused for a moment on one of the sequences so the eye could pull it together, then frame against frame, then pause on the strong visual sequence.
Normally I wouldn't use such a technique in only one place, because things like that work best when they are tied together throughout a vid. Otherwise you end up with the audience going WTF? But since I'd already used nearly subliminal edits before, it came across as a cool extension of those edits. I knew those four-frame sequences would bother some people, and they would feel frustrated because they couldn't see what was going on, but that was the effect I was going for -- jarring, flashing by so fast you weren't certain what you'd seen. Not only does it match the music, for me, it matches the feeling of the movie, which uses a lot of quick cuts and camera angle changes. The song lets me place those well, too, so that they aren't constant. If they were every single line, the audience would run screaming. I love those fast clips, because my eye grabs a different scene every time I watch it. But people will be frustrated, regardless -- the human eye still needs about 15 frames of video for us to process what we're seeing. We can see and grab bits of information with less, but if we want to really be able to absorb it, we need at least 15 frames. Those fast cuts are four frames apiece, except at the end, where they're five frames because they slowed the beats down a hair.
More than anything, it's a technique to layer the vid. I'd felt compelled to use special effects, but they just weren't working. The only time the stop motion blur worked was on the two drag racing scenes I used it on. There's something about being able to use effects now, and having to "compete" with other vidders in the fandom who really know how to use effects, that makes me feel like I *have* to do it, even though, of course, I don't. This vid ended up being a reminder that something simple, like an editing technique of nearly subliminal cutting, can achieve an effect that is just as powerful as a filter or a transition.
I often remark that I'm the support hose of vidders. I'm not this flashy, effects-competent person, and until recently, I used a program that didn't allow much in that department, and only two years ago was using VCRs, which didn't allow *any*. I believe that people are dazzled by the arty types, and those are the vids that get pimped all over the Net, not vids like mine, which are not flashy and stylish and I'm definitely no visual artist as anyone can tell. I know good visuals, but I'm not much in the art department myself in terms of thinking up new incredible arty things to do with a vid; I come from a storytelling background, and there I fear I will stay. I think that a lot of people are hungry for good story vids, though, because of the types of discussions I see after VVC or other con shows -- it's the vids that maybe didn't have as much flash and dash but have a killer theme or mood that get talked about the most afterwards. Online audiences maybe go for the flash more, which sometimes depresses me a little, because I know that I can make something like Loaded Gun, which I feel is one of my very best vids, and it will come and go quickly. I'm very solid, but people online tend to be drawn less to solid than to jazzy. It's just the only way I know how to be, though.
And sometimes when I sit back and just try to look objectively at what I've created, I wonder if that pressure for effects is going too far, that pressure to have a vid look like nothing else. Because if I just look objectively at Loaded Gun, I think, wow, this is a great vid. *I'd* watch it again and again if it weren't mine. And it's not all flashy and dashy, its techniques are fairly simple in a lot of ways. The pendulum might be swinging back, though. For most people, all that really matters is seeing their woobies. For others, a good solid story will sell them even if the vid isn't flashy. It might be that those two audiences are really all that matters. As a vidder, it's hard when you feel like you can't get arrested, with all the big name vidders who get all the attention because they're fishnet stockings or sheer glitter. But as an audience member, you still get what you want when the support hose or tummy control vidders go to work -- your woobies on screen, sometimes maybe if you're lucky a strong story. I don't know. I go back and forth on this a lot. When friends bemoan the fishnet-worshipping culture, I point out that it's the basic everyday hosiery that people talk about; but often when I'm left alone to my own devices, I forget that and bemoan my own support hose status.
Regardless of where I stand in the hosiery section, though, I wanted to make a vid that would really appeal foremost to those in the fandom. I don't think it's as accessible to those not familiar with the movie as Stripped is, or other vids in the fandom. And that's a tradeoff -- you want people to notice your vid, to see it, otherwise you wouldn't spend a fortune on web hosting sites so you could post your vids. But you have to make the story that you want to make, too, and I knew Loaded Gun wasn't an easy sell to an average unfamiliar viewer. I've been pleasantly surprised, though, to find that a lot of people still find it accessible at the most basic story level, so that's a bonus. Because even if you make it with fans in mind, there's always that hope for a kick-in-the-pants "you converted me/got me interested" thing that makes so many of us vidders ecstatic. Communicating to a ready-made audience is relatively easy (see above, where all you need is woobies on screen), but grabbing newcomers... that's a serious kick.
I worried as well that the editing technique with the fast cuts would put people off, but overall even those who've expressed frustration don't seem to mind it, just that they can't get everything (which is what I was going for, so they shouldn't be so hard on themselves). This, to me, is the hardest thing about helping someone get into vidding -- how to communicate the ability to know what techniques to choose, when, and why. Some people pick it up easily; for others, it never really penetrates. Even stuff like point of view, which is so badly misunderstood by most vidders, or tone of voice, can be beyond some vidders' grasp. (But then again, I see so much misunderstanding about things like POV in fiction, I suppose it's to be expected, since visual arts are so mysterious to most people.) I think there's a balance between "I make what I want to make" and "I make things just to appease the audience." That battle has never made sense to me and when I see arguments about audience vs. vidder intention I just shut down and walk away.
I wanted this to be my love song to the movie, and to the fandom, even though I often feel very shut off from this fandom at large compared to my other interests. I wanted people to be able to view it and finally say, "Oh! I get why she's so obsessed!" or "Oh wow, this captures everything I love about the movie!" I believe I've achieved that, even if there's vid overkill in the fandom. And I definitely achieved my goal of making something I could love and be proud of and watch repeatedly. If I'm not sick to death of my own creation by the time I've finished, I figure I'm waaay ahead of the game.
I've been sitting on this song and vid idea for a year, almost exactly. It was last June that I woke up one morning and decided I was obsessed with the Fast and the Furious, after having liked the movie, but not thought too much about it, for a long time. I'd seen Chronicles of Riddick and written an essay about why I still liked Vin Diesel despite the movie (which can be found in my memories), and for some reason, it triggered some sort of latent, slash-needing, recovering from Angel being cancelled thing in me, and next thing I knew I was hoovering up fanfic and talking about vidding. This was the first song I thought of, a song that I'd wanted to vid a long, long time ago for Mulder and Skinner back in my X-Files vidding days, but I didn't think that I could do the things I wanted to on VCRs, and I'm glad I waited so long to use it. The one thing people have commented on so far the most is that the song is letter perfect for the fandom and the characters.
So, why wait so long if the song is perfect? It would seem counterintuitive, if you have the perfect song and the ability, to not make the vid. I felt really strongly then that I needed to focus on the relationship between Brian and Dom, and Loaded Gun was too... big, I guess. Too comprehensive. There was only one other vid online that I could find, Khaleesian's Never Let Me Down (which was one of the first songs I thought of when I decided I wanted to do this, but focus more on the 'ship), and I knew about Zen's cute little Speed Racer vid but that wasn't online. It seemed imperative to me that I use a song that would allow a super-tight focus, because that would be the way to appeal to people, get their interest -- sometimes, a really big, comprehensive story can overwhelm someone new to the fandom. And I knew that Loaded Gun would mean a vid that might not be as accessible to those unfamiliar with the movie.
I hunted for a song, but everything I liked, others hated, and it wasn't until
mlyn pimped some more Depeche Mode at me, and I heard Stripped, that I found what I wanted. So I put Loaded Gun to the side. (And here is where I rant about how sick to death I am of the nasty snipey comments about two -- count 'em, TWO! whole vids to Depeche Mode songs. The horror! Jesus H, what a burden to have two vids to two separate Depeche Mode songs. I don't hear anyone bitching about the 5,000 Highlander vids to yet another bombastic piece of crap from godawful U2, but you do the only other extant F&F vid to Depeche Mode and suddenly you've made it such a misery for all those poor people. Can you tell how sick I am of the comments about it? gah! /rant.) And I think I was on the money about that decision, because the vid really connected with a lot of people who knew nothing about the film, and sparked their interest.In the meantime, I'd planned to go back to Loaded Gun... until all these other vids showed up. A couple of them were good, but a lot of them were just awful. And it seemed like another vid, even if it was a great one, would just be overkill. I didn't want people to feel about F&F the way I felt about Hard Core Logo, where I never wanted to see the movie (even though originally I'd wanted to) because I was so damn sick of the vids. And I still kind of worry about that, and can't help thinking that since the statistical number of hits on this new vid and requests for the PW to my site are much lower this time, that's an indicator that people are vidded out for the movie.
The hard part about acknowledging that is this time, I really tried to use stuff that hasn't been used in other vids, including my own. There's only so much you can do with a two-hour film, clip-wise, but the song afforded me a lot of chances to pull pieces of commonly used clips that weren't getting put in, or make use of sections that don't get used at all. I think that's one of the vid's great strengths, and I was pleased with how it came out in that respect, especially being able to use the deleted gay porn video cover tableau scene, which is unsweetened (meaning it wasn't processed and therefore doesn't look like the rest of the movie). I'd really hoped to color correct it, but I couldn't figure out for the life of me how to do that. So when I lit on the idea of using it subliminally, almost, in that little electronic stutter portion of the music, I was rather tickled with myself. I picked up the technique from
klia and thevetia's Touching Evil vid, Untitled 6, and followed how they edited two separate sequences -- one with a strong visual centered against a busier picture -- one frame against one frame, then paused for a moment on one of the sequences so the eye could pull it together, then frame against frame, then pause on the strong visual sequence. Normally I wouldn't use such a technique in only one place, because things like that work best when they are tied together throughout a vid. Otherwise you end up with the audience going WTF? But since I'd already used nearly subliminal edits before, it came across as a cool extension of those edits. I knew those four-frame sequences would bother some people, and they would feel frustrated because they couldn't see what was going on, but that was the effect I was going for -- jarring, flashing by so fast you weren't certain what you'd seen. Not only does it match the music, for me, it matches the feeling of the movie, which uses a lot of quick cuts and camera angle changes. The song lets me place those well, too, so that they aren't constant. If they were every single line, the audience would run screaming. I love those fast clips, because my eye grabs a different scene every time I watch it. But people will be frustrated, regardless -- the human eye still needs about 15 frames of video for us to process what we're seeing. We can see and grab bits of information with less, but if we want to really be able to absorb it, we need at least 15 frames. Those fast cuts are four frames apiece, except at the end, where they're five frames because they slowed the beats down a hair.
More than anything, it's a technique to layer the vid. I'd felt compelled to use special effects, but they just weren't working. The only time the stop motion blur worked was on the two drag racing scenes I used it on. There's something about being able to use effects now, and having to "compete" with other vidders in the fandom who really know how to use effects, that makes me feel like I *have* to do it, even though, of course, I don't. This vid ended up being a reminder that something simple, like an editing technique of nearly subliminal cutting, can achieve an effect that is just as powerful as a filter or a transition.
I often remark that I'm the support hose of vidders. I'm not this flashy, effects-competent person, and until recently, I used a program that didn't allow much in that department, and only two years ago was using VCRs, which didn't allow *any*. I believe that people are dazzled by the arty types, and those are the vids that get pimped all over the Net, not vids like mine, which are not flashy and stylish and I'm definitely no visual artist as anyone can tell. I know good visuals, but I'm not much in the art department myself in terms of thinking up new incredible arty things to do with a vid; I come from a storytelling background, and there I fear I will stay. I think that a lot of people are hungry for good story vids, though, because of the types of discussions I see after VVC or other con shows -- it's the vids that maybe didn't have as much flash and dash but have a killer theme or mood that get talked about the most afterwards. Online audiences maybe go for the flash more, which sometimes depresses me a little, because I know that I can make something like Loaded Gun, which I feel is one of my very best vids, and it will come and go quickly. I'm very solid, but people online tend to be drawn less to solid than to jazzy. It's just the only way I know how to be, though.
And sometimes when I sit back and just try to look objectively at what I've created, I wonder if that pressure for effects is going too far, that pressure to have a vid look like nothing else. Because if I just look objectively at Loaded Gun, I think, wow, this is a great vid. *I'd* watch it again and again if it weren't mine. And it's not all flashy and dashy, its techniques are fairly simple in a lot of ways. The pendulum might be swinging back, though. For most people, all that really matters is seeing their woobies. For others, a good solid story will sell them even if the vid isn't flashy. It might be that those two audiences are really all that matters. As a vidder, it's hard when you feel like you can't get arrested, with all the big name vidders who get all the attention because they're fishnet stockings or sheer glitter. But as an audience member, you still get what you want when the support hose or tummy control vidders go to work -- your woobies on screen, sometimes maybe if you're lucky a strong story. I don't know. I go back and forth on this a lot. When friends bemoan the fishnet-worshipping culture, I point out that it's the basic everyday hosiery that people talk about; but often when I'm left alone to my own devices, I forget that and bemoan my own support hose status.
Regardless of where I stand in the hosiery section, though, I wanted to make a vid that would really appeal foremost to those in the fandom. I don't think it's as accessible to those not familiar with the movie as Stripped is, or other vids in the fandom. And that's a tradeoff -- you want people to notice your vid, to see it, otherwise you wouldn't spend a fortune on web hosting sites so you could post your vids. But you have to make the story that you want to make, too, and I knew Loaded Gun wasn't an easy sell to an average unfamiliar viewer. I've been pleasantly surprised, though, to find that a lot of people still find it accessible at the most basic story level, so that's a bonus. Because even if you make it with fans in mind, there's always that hope for a kick-in-the-pants "you converted me/got me interested" thing that makes so many of us vidders ecstatic. Communicating to a ready-made audience is relatively easy (see above, where all you need is woobies on screen), but grabbing newcomers... that's a serious kick.
I worried as well that the editing technique with the fast cuts would put people off, but overall even those who've expressed frustration don't seem to mind it, just that they can't get everything (which is what I was going for, so they shouldn't be so hard on themselves). This, to me, is the hardest thing about helping someone get into vidding -- how to communicate the ability to know what techniques to choose, when, and why. Some people pick it up easily; for others, it never really penetrates. Even stuff like point of view, which is so badly misunderstood by most vidders, or tone of voice, can be beyond some vidders' grasp. (But then again, I see so much misunderstanding about things like POV in fiction, I suppose it's to be expected, since visual arts are so mysterious to most people.) I think there's a balance between "I make what I want to make" and "I make things just to appease the audience." That battle has never made sense to me and when I see arguments about audience vs. vidder intention I just shut down and walk away.
I wanted this to be my love song to the movie, and to the fandom, even though I often feel very shut off from this fandom at large compared to my other interests. I wanted people to be able to view it and finally say, "Oh! I get why she's so obsessed!" or "Oh wow, this captures everything I love about the movie!" I believe I've achieved that, even if there's vid overkill in the fandom. And I definitely achieved my goal of making something I could love and be proud of and watch repeatedly. If I'm not sick to death of my own creation by the time I've finished, I figure I'm waaay ahead of the game.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2005-07-09 11:47 pm (UTC)I actually use fast cuts a *lot*, and I know it will annoy some viewers that they can't register all the clips, but I don't really care. I confess that I'm completely mystified about what makes vids "good" or popular, but I know what I like, and I try to make vids that I will enjoy watching. If you achieve that, as a vidder, I think you've won the only part of the battle that really counts.
I enjoyed the vid, btw. It's been a long time since I've seen the movie, but it was pretty and fun to watch.
I also downloaded Santa Monica at the same time, which I lovedlovedloved. I miss my vampire boys.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-10 03:30 pm (UTC)I wanted to comment when you put the vid up, but we've had storms and yesterday was the first day I had a couple of hours when I wasn't losing power to download it (there are downsides to still being on a dial up...I need a few hours where I can download big things and nothing else.)
I've now watched it a couple of times and caught something new every time. I'm also a fan of fast cuts and have been even before everyone went to computer vidding (I can't remember what vid I saw that someone had done it on vcr's -- Pro's probably, where my jaw just dropped.) And I'm rather glad you haven't quite mastered the bulk of special effect. I think they are cool and everything, but I have to admit on some vids, special effects seem to take the place of either story or trying to make a particular point and I much prefer that done within the story to trying to frame it out by using some flash of roll and echo.
And maybe because much of my "style" of vids was framed by having been exposed to your stuff and the rest of the media cannibals early on. I'm rarely disappointed by anything you guys do and you especially, since story and POV really are important markers in your vids and I'm a viewer that responds to a story line (or an inside joke) as opposed to vids that do or try to say something else -- and relationship exploration in a vid is my favorite thing ever.
I actually tend to think that more exposure to vids might actually create a desire for more purposed vids. I hope so anyway, because they are more (or should be IMO) than just pictures set to a catchy song. I don't want the lyrics to do all the work, nor the clips either and a good vid uses both together, so ultimately special effects that don't actually support either don't have any purpose.
Anyway, I'm babbling because it was that good. And I really truly loved the whole set up of Brian being there to do one thing only to get tangled up and dragged in and down himself. Very much a perfect film commentary.
I do want to say though that the Gay Porn Vid tableau didn't work as much for me even though it was fun (And I'm thrilled that somebody used it) It wasn't the effect so much as I feel I missed the point it was trying to make. (Maybe if I Watch it another fifty-eleven times I'll get it. I'm not so good with the subtle.)
Anyway, I loved it muchly and it will probably go down as one of my favorites.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-11 01:35 am (UTC)Myself, I think that the argument of audience vs. vidder personal satisfaction isn't... I don't know. I just don't understand why the argument at all. I can't help believing that if you make a vid you're proud of, you bring the audience along with you. There's no way on earth you can please all of the people all of the time, so you work at doing the things that please you, and that will please others like you, and if you understand that motivation and you understand why it is you like what you like, you can communicate with likeminded people. I don't think people have to ignore the audience to please themselves, and vice versa. It's an ongoing... er, discussion I see a lot, but I'm not sure I've ever bought into the audience vs. vidder thing. If you're doing a good job, you'll bring the audience with you, I've always thought.
But, also, I have been known to fly very outside the normal airspace on all things vidding.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-11 01:55 am (UTC)I wonder if that was our Pros vid A Fire is Burning? Hell, my jaw dropped on that one when we made it! You might also be thinking of that HL vid Us, where Sandy did one small section with three or four frame edits, which was really mindboggling to me at the time.
That is really exciting to me that people see that. When you're working on these things, you get so tightly focused that you often wonder, Is anyone going to get what I want to show with this? Will people see that I'm trying to say something? So I love it when it's clear enough. No matter how goofy the movie is, it really hits something in me as a story that I wanted to share with others, the more personal aspect of Brian losing himself to Dom (and D to B, as well).
I got this incredible LOC from
In the case of the gay porn cover, I wanted something that counterpointed Dom's face, all serious and sad. I wanted something that would flash in and out with those blippy sounds really well. And I could never color correct the deleted scene, so that seemed like a perfect fit -- it's this silly, almost happy scene of the world they lived in then, counterpointed with this very sad, serious scene of the world Dom has been living in, that he's telling to Brian. No real meaning, just two radically different-feeling clips, counterpointed in a way where I could use one that I couldn't normally use. I could just as easily have used the barbecue scene, for instance, or something from the party, where there are more characters as well. Does that help at all? Or make any sense? Probably not, but I honestly don't know how to explain it.
Of course, now the Sekrit Society of Vidder Knowledge is going to have to kill me.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-11 04:51 am (UTC)And I'm not sick to death of F&F vids. Granted, I haven't seen as many as you apparently have, but here's the thing: I love this fandom. I can't imagine myself getting tired of seeing fan work for it. Maybe I won't watch or read it all, but it at least pleases me that people are still producing. So those people who liked seeing F&F vids and now don't...maybe their fan status should be questioned. Or maybe I'm just being self-centered.
Anyway, I love the vid, and you know it. I'm thrilled to have it on DVD now, so I can blare the song on my TV rather than my computer, and watch it over and over again. Thank you for the hard work.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-11 04:58 am (UTC)Even a year on, I still haven't lost my love for it, either. I would have thought I would, but... making this vid made it feel every bit as alive.
no subject
Date: 2005-07-11 05:07 am (UTC)I can definitely identify with that. Last fall people were calling me the fandom cheerleader, but these days I'm ignoring fic on
But I went right back into giddy fangirl mode when I watched this vid, both the half-finished version and the final. Y'know, clapping delightedly and squeeing in the higher registers. I think I woke up a neighbor's dog. Heh.