Someday, she'll tell you
Nov. 27th, 2002 06:25 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
gwynSpoilers ahoy!! For Buffy episode of 11/26, Never Leave Me. Watch out, mateys!
Joss Whedon owes me a box of Kleenex. Or better yet, Drew Goddard. Who is fast becoming the man I want to marry after his wonderful episodes this year -- he's my spiritual fiance, and he doesn't know it, but we'll connect someday, I'm sure of it. What's with the tears? I haven't cried in five freaking years over this show, and suddenly I'm a big ball of weepiness. Beneath You's final scenes made me sniffly, and now Buffy's telling Spike that she believes in him... arg. I will send the bill for my tissue supply to Mutant Enemy soon.
I don't honestly know if this is Cassie's "someday, she'll tell you." Maybe it is, maybe there's more (and yes, I feel like I should put more than spoiler warnings on my page or something, since so many people seem incensed or disgusted that I'm heavy into B/S, but I am, and that's that, and everything I see in the relationship on screen is colored by my feelings for the pairing, so there), but to tide me through the holiday hiatus, it works pretty damn well. She believes in him. She saw him change. She understands he made a conscious choice to change, for whatever his motivations, and she's giving him credit for that. (Hell, in some ways, even Xander seems willing to give him a nod for that.) And I looked upon it and it made my heart glad (and my eyeballs moist). I found both their conversations to be incredibly powerful in so many ways, but at the heart of it was that they were talking. Something we've never really seen them do since their tentative friendship in S6 that was so soon obliterated by the sex. Like adult people, too: angry at times, hearing, not wanting to hear, arguing, seeing.
That last is crucial for me, because I don't believe that Buffy really saw Spike, who he could be, last year, nor could he see her because of his idealized vision of her, not to mention his inabilities as a vampire to see into humans' souls. Spike challenged Buffy about her inability to kill him (and he asked again for her to do it! Sorry, this is a huge kink of mine, a person having to kill their lover... I'm a freak, whatever), Buffy confronted her fatalistic view of life, they finally spoke truths to each other. I'm certain that Spike is coming back to the Scoobie fold, and this all finally opens the way for them to work together to fight the First Evil, which they couldn't do as powerful allies if they hadn't got to those truths. And? It made me cry. I'm a big old mushball, but there it is.
I thought the lighting was again interesting in this episode. Spike being tied, almost cruciform (again, returning to imagery in Beneath You), to that device, and the lighting from the side that made his white hair look almost halo-esque, has to be a key. Lighting is one of the most complicated and time-consuming processes in the fast paced world of TV, and the tricks they were using, the contrasts of light and dark, were too important for it to have been haphazard. And it was interesting to me that for the first time I can remember, they used a musical theme in the Spike and Buffy scenes. In the past they've either used no music or available music, this time they had a quieter theme underneath it. A signal that they're actually making this more of a relationship? I don't know. But fascinating. Oh, and a side note -- I imagine Spike hasn't seen himself in years. I keep wondering, since we've never seen him with photos of himself and have no idea when the last time he would have seen what he looks like was, what he thinks of seeing "himself" when Morphy's around.
And the return of my beloved Willow, the Will I fell in love with! The look on Will's face when she first saw Andrew gave me chills, and then her conversation with him, from his "stand down, she-witch" to her diatribe of scary power phrases, and then the "okay?" made me shout with glee. It was the Willow of old, the one who can call on resolve face and a backbone of steel when she has to, and then immediately melts into a pile of Jell-O when it's over. God, I love her, and I missed her, and I was so happy to see her back. (Not to mention the "Do you want me to kill Anya?")
Xander was wonderful -- it was as if he had waited his whole life to play good cop/bad cop, and he was so caught up in it. Since Selfless, it seems like he's beginning to get more of an understanding of what his role is, and just how complex all their interrelationships are. When he told Andrew about the man with the heart replaced by darkness, it was so touching, especially as we're watching him come back from that and start to see that all of them have their own issues, and he doesn't get to play judge and jury all the time.
So the council is all blowed up. We don't know what happened to Giles (but come on, we know he's okay. He's Giles!), but it's interesting how they think they have the power to do something, yet clearly were unprepared for the more modern threat of an explosion or violence to their "operatives" (when did the COW become Section One?). And when did Harris Yulin get so old? Man, I flipped channels afterwards to 24 and there he was again. He's always been one of my fave character actors and played my all-time favorite villain on La Femme Nikita (he ripped his own daughter's throat out with his teeth! Whee!), and I love him as creepy Quentin, but he seemed so old suddenly.
I don't like Andrew as a character in many respects, because I find his adoration of Warren and his far-less-moral-than-Spike attitude really disturbing (I actually found Warren to be the ickiest baddy they've ever had on the show, I hated him from the moment I saw him in I Was Made to Love You), but he does make me laugh, and in this episode I laughed a lot. His attempts to be like Spike with the coat and the boots and the hair were a riot, and I loved the butcher calling him "Neo." The actor has a nice chemistry, though, with everyone there, especially Allyson Hannigan, so watching the Scoobs interact with him later could prove entertaining. I also liked the fact that no one can remember his name or who he is, and even when Buffy said, "Tucker's brother" to Spike, he just said oh, as if "well, that explains it... right." A nice little touch running through seasons. Even as Morphy Jonathan, it's good to see Danny Strong, as always, and it's interesting that the FE is using him as well to get Andrew to do its bidding.
Everyone's been speculating about the principal -- is he going to get eaten, will he survive, is he a white hat or a black hat? This added a nice layer of mystery to him and I'm curious to see what they'll do. The otherwise waste-of-scene opener with the two boys was a big clue that he'd play some more important role in the episode, but I admit, that wasn't quite the role I was expecting. Very curious to see more.
A few things I'm still unclear about: So, raising a vampire from the seal was the best the FE can do? It confirmed for us that it can't take corporeal form, which we knew from Amends, but if this is all it was trying to do, it's kind of puny. I can only believe that it isn't, that it was a vampire's blood bringing something forth and if someone else had been bled over it more fully, then something else would have risen. Because if the corporeal threat is Max Schrek's Nosferatu on crank, that doesn't seem... all that threatening. What it will do to Spike is possibly the big catch they're going for as well, but overall, I'm still a little nonplussed about the hugeness of this threat if so far all it's doing is this and blowing up the COW.
I'm also wondering about Dawn. Her friendship with Spike was pretty intense. Yet out of all of them, even Xander these days, she seems most willing to jump on the "kill him" bandwagon. I know she's a teenager and all and feels protective of Buffy, but it seems odd to me that she hasn't moved past that and tried to remember her friendship with him, when she believed in him. Plus, I'd like them to interact more, because whem MT and JM act together, he brings out amazing stuff in her.
The addiction to blood and the withdrawals. We've never seen this, we've never even had it hinted at. The closest we've come is watching Angel feed on Buffy in Graduation Day, when he could barely stop himself, but the whole shakes and pains from kicking thing... when did t his happen? When did this become part of the universe? It seemed really random and weird to me, very... lame, I suppose. Well, like many things I dislike, I just plan to speedbump right over it. ;-) I admit, also, that I simply couldn't watch the Spike drinking from the bag of blood scene. Ew. Especially knowing what they put in that concoction, it makes it even harder -- it's not the blood that ews me, it's the whole feeding/gulping/concoction thing. Again, I'm weird, sue me. Also, why was Holden, in CWDP, buried in the cemetery if he's one of the "Spike under control of Morphy" sired victims, but the rest were buried in that cellar? I'm not sure on the relationships of these things yet; maybe it's just continuity errors.
So much other delightful stuff -- Anya hitting Xander and being sorry, the fact that they're all talking and planning together, Buffy putting it all together and figuring it out, Spike in chains (perv, yes, I know)... I just couldn't be happier. These past three episodes have rocked my world, and while I can't quite give this a ten, it's pretty close. If I had a scale with points in it, I'd give it a 9.8. If this is what Buffy will tell Spike, it made my shipper heart beat fast, because it's pretty much the forgiveness that I feel Cassie meant; and if it's not, and there's hope that Buffy could love Spike, I'd be even happier, so then I have to save my 10 for that episode. Yes, I realize it's unlikely to come, but everything in this episode makes me believe it's possible.
Joss Whedon owes me a box of Kleenex. Or better yet, Drew Goddard. Who is fast becoming the man I want to marry after his wonderful episodes this year -- he's my spiritual fiance, and he doesn't know it, but we'll connect someday, I'm sure of it. What's with the tears? I haven't cried in five freaking years over this show, and suddenly I'm a big ball of weepiness. Beneath You's final scenes made me sniffly, and now Buffy's telling Spike that she believes in him... arg. I will send the bill for my tissue supply to Mutant Enemy soon.
I don't honestly know if this is Cassie's "someday, she'll tell you." Maybe it is, maybe there's more (and yes, I feel like I should put more than spoiler warnings on my page or something, since so many people seem incensed or disgusted that I'm heavy into B/S, but I am, and that's that, and everything I see in the relationship on screen is colored by my feelings for the pairing, so there), but to tide me through the holiday hiatus, it works pretty damn well. She believes in him. She saw him change. She understands he made a conscious choice to change, for whatever his motivations, and she's giving him credit for that. (Hell, in some ways, even Xander seems willing to give him a nod for that.) And I looked upon it and it made my heart glad (and my eyeballs moist). I found both their conversations to be incredibly powerful in so many ways, but at the heart of it was that they were talking. Something we've never really seen them do since their tentative friendship in S6 that was so soon obliterated by the sex. Like adult people, too: angry at times, hearing, not wanting to hear, arguing, seeing.
That last is crucial for me, because I don't believe that Buffy really saw Spike, who he could be, last year, nor could he see her because of his idealized vision of her, not to mention his inabilities as a vampire to see into humans' souls. Spike challenged Buffy about her inability to kill him (and he asked again for her to do it! Sorry, this is a huge kink of mine, a person having to kill their lover... I'm a freak, whatever), Buffy confronted her fatalistic view of life, they finally spoke truths to each other. I'm certain that Spike is coming back to the Scoobie fold, and this all finally opens the way for them to work together to fight the First Evil, which they couldn't do as powerful allies if they hadn't got to those truths. And? It made me cry. I'm a big old mushball, but there it is.
I thought the lighting was again interesting in this episode. Spike being tied, almost cruciform (again, returning to imagery in Beneath You), to that device, and the lighting from the side that made his white hair look almost halo-esque, has to be a key. Lighting is one of the most complicated and time-consuming processes in the fast paced world of TV, and the tricks they were using, the contrasts of light and dark, were too important for it to have been haphazard. And it was interesting to me that for the first time I can remember, they used a musical theme in the Spike and Buffy scenes. In the past they've either used no music or available music, this time they had a quieter theme underneath it. A signal that they're actually making this more of a relationship? I don't know. But fascinating. Oh, and a side note -- I imagine Spike hasn't seen himself in years. I keep wondering, since we've never seen him with photos of himself and have no idea when the last time he would have seen what he looks like was, what he thinks of seeing "himself" when Morphy's around.
And the return of my beloved Willow, the Will I fell in love with! The look on Will's face when she first saw Andrew gave me chills, and then her conversation with him, from his "stand down, she-witch" to her diatribe of scary power phrases, and then the "okay?" made me shout with glee. It was the Willow of old, the one who can call on resolve face and a backbone of steel when she has to, and then immediately melts into a pile of Jell-O when it's over. God, I love her, and I missed her, and I was so happy to see her back. (Not to mention the "Do you want me to kill Anya?")
Xander was wonderful -- it was as if he had waited his whole life to play good cop/bad cop, and he was so caught up in it. Since Selfless, it seems like he's beginning to get more of an understanding of what his role is, and just how complex all their interrelationships are. When he told Andrew about the man with the heart replaced by darkness, it was so touching, especially as we're watching him come back from that and start to see that all of them have their own issues, and he doesn't get to play judge and jury all the time.
So the council is all blowed up. We don't know what happened to Giles (but come on, we know he's okay. He's Giles!), but it's interesting how they think they have the power to do something, yet clearly were unprepared for the more modern threat of an explosion or violence to their "operatives" (when did the COW become Section One?). And when did Harris Yulin get so old? Man, I flipped channels afterwards to 24 and there he was again. He's always been one of my fave character actors and played my all-time favorite villain on La Femme Nikita (he ripped his own daughter's throat out with his teeth! Whee!), and I love him as creepy Quentin, but he seemed so old suddenly.
I don't like Andrew as a character in many respects, because I find his adoration of Warren and his far-less-moral-than-Spike attitude really disturbing (I actually found Warren to be the ickiest baddy they've ever had on the show, I hated him from the moment I saw him in I Was Made to Love You), but he does make me laugh, and in this episode I laughed a lot. His attempts to be like Spike with the coat and the boots and the hair were a riot, and I loved the butcher calling him "Neo." The actor has a nice chemistry, though, with everyone there, especially Allyson Hannigan, so watching the Scoobs interact with him later could prove entertaining. I also liked the fact that no one can remember his name or who he is, and even when Buffy said, "Tucker's brother" to Spike, he just said oh, as if "well, that explains it... right." A nice little touch running through seasons. Even as Morphy Jonathan, it's good to see Danny Strong, as always, and it's interesting that the FE is using him as well to get Andrew to do its bidding.
Everyone's been speculating about the principal -- is he going to get eaten, will he survive, is he a white hat or a black hat? This added a nice layer of mystery to him and I'm curious to see what they'll do. The otherwise waste-of-scene opener with the two boys was a big clue that he'd play some more important role in the episode, but I admit, that wasn't quite the role I was expecting. Very curious to see more.
A few things I'm still unclear about: So, raising a vampire from the seal was the best the FE can do? It confirmed for us that it can't take corporeal form, which we knew from Amends, but if this is all it was trying to do, it's kind of puny. I can only believe that it isn't, that it was a vampire's blood bringing something forth and if someone else had been bled over it more fully, then something else would have risen. Because if the corporeal threat is Max Schrek's Nosferatu on crank, that doesn't seem... all that threatening. What it will do to Spike is possibly the big catch they're going for as well, but overall, I'm still a little nonplussed about the hugeness of this threat if so far all it's doing is this and blowing up the COW.
I'm also wondering about Dawn. Her friendship with Spike was pretty intense. Yet out of all of them, even Xander these days, she seems most willing to jump on the "kill him" bandwagon. I know she's a teenager and all and feels protective of Buffy, but it seems odd to me that she hasn't moved past that and tried to remember her friendship with him, when she believed in him. Plus, I'd like them to interact more, because whem MT and JM act together, he brings out amazing stuff in her.
The addiction to blood and the withdrawals. We've never seen this, we've never even had it hinted at. The closest we've come is watching Angel feed on Buffy in Graduation Day, when he could barely stop himself, but the whole shakes and pains from kicking thing... when did t his happen? When did this become part of the universe? It seemed really random and weird to me, very... lame, I suppose. Well, like many things I dislike, I just plan to speedbump right over it. ;-) I admit, also, that I simply couldn't watch the Spike drinking from the bag of blood scene. Ew. Especially knowing what they put in that concoction, it makes it even harder -- it's not the blood that ews me, it's the whole feeding/gulping/concoction thing. Again, I'm weird, sue me. Also, why was Holden, in CWDP, buried in the cemetery if he's one of the "Spike under control of Morphy" sired victims, but the rest were buried in that cellar? I'm not sure on the relationships of these things yet; maybe it's just continuity errors.
So much other delightful stuff -- Anya hitting Xander and being sorry, the fact that they're all talking and planning together, Buffy putting it all together and figuring it out, Spike in chains (perv, yes, I know)... I just couldn't be happier. These past three episodes have rocked my world, and while I can't quite give this a ten, it's pretty close. If I had a scale with points in it, I'd give it a 9.8. If this is what Buffy will tell Spike, it made my shipper heart beat fast, because it's pretty much the forgiveness that I feel Cassie meant; and if it's not, and there's hope that Buffy could love Spike, I'd be even happier, so then I have to save my 10 for that episode. Yes, I realize it's unlikely to come, but everything in this episode makes me believe it's possible.
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no subject
Date: 2002-11-27 07:27 am (UTC)And this...
I keep wondering, since we've never seen him with photos of himself and have no idea when the last time he would have seen what he looks like was, what he thinks of seeing "himself" when Morphy's around.
Oooooo! I never even thought of that before. No wonder the FE keeps taking Spike's form to haunt him. Great observation.
no subject
Date: 2002-11-27 09:46 am (UTC)Yeah, I thought it was lame too. Like, SR lame, or magic-addiction lame. But unlike those, this is a little thing that I can pretend didn't happen, and still enjoy the show.
Spike in chains (perv, yes, I know)... I just couldn't be happier.
Myself, I loved it when he stood up and jerked toward Buffy, so his arms were pulled behind him, and we could see all those lovely chess & shoulder muscles.
no subject
Date: 2002-11-27 10:55 am (UTC)I'm just fascinated by the whole being able to see themselves things about vampires, and I wonder if Morphy had more control over Spike by appearing in his own half-remembered face, or if it was appearing as Buffy or someone else like Dru that would have more sway. It's hard to tell... one of those "stuff I wish I knew" things that'll probably never be answered.
Rashaka, I think I used extra Kleenex over the pulling on the chains thing. God, he looks fine like that. Um. Is it hot in here, or what?
no subject
Date: 2002-11-27 07:07 pm (UTC)Oh, and a side note -- I imagine Spike hasn't seen himself in years. I keep wondering, since we've never seen him with photos of himself and have no idea when the last time he would have seen what he looks like was, what he thinks of seeing "himself" when Morphy's around.
What a wonderful observation, i never even thought of that. Not that they would ever address this,but that would be something i would like to be seen, what Spike thinks of himself after all these years. Seriously, this gives me such a great new perspective.
I also agree with your feelings about the shaping of Willow and Xander. I haven't liked their characters is quite some time and this episode reminded me so much of what i enjoyed about them in years past.
So, raising a vampire from the seal was the best the FE can do? ... Because if the corporeal threat is Max Schrek's Nosferatu on crank, that doesn't seem... all that threatening.
Firstly, HA! Secondly, i agree. I'm kinda waiting for the First Evil to really do something...evil Cause, oooh, haunted the scoobs, manipulated Spike to kill and sire a bunch of people(yeah, cause THAT'S unusual for a vamp to do), raised a "real vampire" that kinda reminded me of the Fear demon from "Fear, Itself", etc,etc... I'm really thinking (or at least, hoping) there is a purpose to all this. That raising the ubervamp is more than just a monster of the week deal. Cause, why else would the council be so freaked out? I still hold, tho, that the FE is not the real BB, but the distraction of what is really coming...
It seemed really random and weird to me, very... lame, I suppose.
Uh, yeah! What is it with ME and drug/addiction metaphors? Again, i'm hoping it was something more. Something more than the very "lame" idea that he was going through withdrawal from human blood. It just seems odd to just add this in this episode, considering we never saw that happen before with any vamp character,even when Spike was first chipped. Yes, he was starved and sickly, but wasn't all with the shaking and sweating. Maybe he should get Willow to get him some of that water or teach him to grow new skin ;)
Also, why was Holden, in CWDP, buried in the cemetery if he's one of the "Spike under control of Morphy" sired victims, but the rest were buried in that cellar?
Been wondering the same thing. I've been wondering who this vamp was, if he really was just a random vamp, a device ME could use for Buffy to address her many issues. Or was this vamp sent to distract Buffy from returning to house to help Dawn? I'm not sure if his burial is significant simply because of what was saif in the beginning of NLM. About the possibility that there could be many others that SPike could have killed ("I killed half of sunnydale..."), buried in various places that they could not even know about. We have no idea how longthe FE has been manipulating SPike into killing people, so... After all, there was that girl from the Bronze as well,who we don't know where she was buried, either. Maybe the FE started having Spike bury these people in the cellar because he didn't like the mess.
Again, awesome review and uh, sorry for the rambling. Like i said, you brought out so many thoughts!
no subject
Date: 2002-11-27 10:27 pm (UTC)Oh god, Ali, I was drinking some Bailey's when I read this and ended up snorting it up my nose! Ow, ow, ow. But laughing.
I can't help but feel there's some purpose in introducing such a concept. I'm just not sure what it could be, and why. I'm willing to suspend a little of my disbelief, but outside of using it as a fairly limp plot device, what ME's direction on this is a little baffling. But maybe... maybe there's a reason... maybe the FE is creating this kind of dependence in him, maybe overriding his chip so that he doesn't even know he's doing these things is contributing the Panic in Needle Park stuff, I don't know. And I guess we won't until later!
I still hold, tho, that the FE is not the real BB, but the distraction of what is really coming...
Yeah, good point. I'd almost rather that be the case. I know that for years, people have joked and snickered at the first evil in Amends. It didn't help, of course, that Buffy herself sneered at it with "all right, I get it, you're EEEvil." So perhaps there's going to be more bang for our bucks later.