The broccoli test
Sep. 21st, 2004 09:12 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
gwynI thought about writing about the release of the original Star Wars movies on DVD today, because I was one of those folks who was at the premiere of the first movie and have often written about the way it completely changed filmgoing as we knew it then. But, yawn. I'm sure everyone else will talk about it this week at least from the historical perspective. I was fascinated by the fact that I knew I was watching a sea change in filmgoing even while I was at the theatre. And like many, I'm disappointed in the changes to the movies wrought by Lucas's annoying need to soften and crowd his visuals, especially because Han Solo shot first, goddammit, and I will never stop being peeved that the film has been changed so much that only those people with laserdisc versions and bad tapes will have that preserved in anything but memory.
But it got me thinking about how I've always wanted to vid Star Wars, especially Han. Yet, strangely, it's never been a huge fandom for me, despite the hundreds of viewings of the first movie and its even better sequel, The Empire Strikes Back. (Jedi I can seriously live without, though it does have some good moments.) There are two great fanfic writers that I know of who've written excellent H/L slash, Cara Loupe and Marie Blackpool, and I loved reading those stories. Yet I never have been tempted to write them, myself, which I couldn't really figure out.
I thought about the people I'm most drawn to writing and tend to vid the most, and it dawned on me when I was telling![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
mlyn about the broccoli test, just what connects characters to me besides my interest in increasingly taciturn men: all of my favorite fannish pairings are characters who pass the broccoli test. Much as I love many others, if they're not broccoli test material, I don't feel as much of a desire to write about them.
I know I will get a lot of this wrong, since I'm telling it from memory over a decade old, butsherrold was the one who came up with the broccoli test idea when she was living in L.A. with a friend, C. As legend, and my mind filling in blanks, would tell it, Sandy and C were at the grocery store, on opposite ends of the produce section, and Sandy was trying to tell C to pick up some broccoli without shouting across the store at her. No amount of pantomiming and mouthing of the words could get the point across to C, and Sandy apparently told her (we were all in the midst of Professionals-mania then), "Doyle would have known Bodie wanted him to pick up some broccoli with just a raise of his eyebrow!" or something like that. Hence, Bodie and Doyle would have passed the broccoli test. (Sandy, please correct my wrongness here!)
And they do. The best pairings, for me, are ones who never have to explain what they want beyond a mere eyebrow-raise or a twitch of the head. Especially because I seem to be attracted to less and less talkative guys -- I've gone from the decidedly unchatty Lt. Castillo on Miami Vice to the churlish AD Skinner on X-Files to the nearly speechless Michael on La Femme Nikita to the taciturn pairing of Chris and Vin in Magnificent 7, culminating in the character who speaks 74 words through an entire two-hour movie, Sgt. Todd in Soldier. These days, I am liking the emotionally volatile but not especially loquacious Dominic Toretto. Spike is a freakish anomoly.
All of these guys pass the broccoli test with their (my) partner of choice. Dom merely looks at Brian after Jesse is killed in The Fast and the Furious, and Brian knows exactly what he wants him to do. After they finally get together and they know their true feelings, Michael can stare blankly at Nikita and she knows what he's telling her. In watching MV eps lately, it's amazing how much Castillo and Crockett say to each other without ever talking. And Chris and Vin... they were passing the broccoli test before they even met! The very first time they even see each other, they exchange a look across a wide street and nod their heads so slightly that if you're not watching carefully, you'd miss it, and then they go off to save a guy from being lynched! They've never even seen each other before. The uber-broccoli test masters, if you ask me.
Luke and Han, though, not so much. Nor Eddie and Monty, nor Angel and Buffy. For such a laconic guy, Angel with Buffy never had that broccoli test quality; though oddly, Spike and Buffy get very close frequently for reasons that mystify me, since Spike is so absurdly chatty and strange. Once he was on Buffy's side, they seemed to have a wierdly connected quality, especially in fighting. Maybe that's another reason why I hate the second half of season 6 so much -- they wrecked the broccoli test quality that Buffy and Spike had cultivated. Angel and Spike have no ability to pass the test at all, but it's charming because they try and we get great comic results. Angel and Wes, also, feint close to it, but never quite get there.
I'll often vid characters who can't pass the test, but I seem to have a tough time writing them -- the one thing that draws me most, a taciturn character paired with a chattier, more social one, is often just hated by most fans, who can't figure out how to write guys who don't talk. But for me that's a huge attraction -- I want that character to tilt his head slightly and the other character to go running off after bad guys. I want oceans of emotion to be conveyed with just a tiny quirk of the mouth. If they're on opposite ends of the produce aisle, I want one to know the other needs broccoli! Because that's the fun in writing in them, I suppose -- trying to convey that intangible quality yourself through words. So I guess there are many fannish loves, but only the most intense will pass the broccoli test, and only those who pass will drive me to write fanfic.
And now this is making me think of Dorinda's theory of clams, which I suppose I'll have to talk about in light of the broccoli test. Mmmmm. Clams and broccoli -- D, we should write an essay!
But it got me thinking about how I've always wanted to vid Star Wars, especially Han. Yet, strangely, it's never been a huge fandom for me, despite the hundreds of viewings of the first movie and its even better sequel, The Empire Strikes Back. (Jedi I can seriously live without, though it does have some good moments.) There are two great fanfic writers that I know of who've written excellent H/L slash, Cara Loupe and Marie Blackpool, and I loved reading those stories. Yet I never have been tempted to write them, myself, which I couldn't really figure out.
I thought about the people I'm most drawn to writing and tend to vid the most, and it dawned on me when I was telling
mlyn about the broccoli test, just what connects characters to me besides my interest in increasingly taciturn men: all of my favorite fannish pairings are characters who pass the broccoli test. Much as I love many others, if they're not broccoli test material, I don't feel as much of a desire to write about them.I know I will get a lot of this wrong, since I'm telling it from memory over a decade old, but
sherrold was the one who came up with the broccoli test idea when she was living in L.A. with a friend, C. As legend, and my mind filling in blanks, would tell it, Sandy and C were at the grocery store, on opposite ends of the produce section, and Sandy was trying to tell C to pick up some broccoli without shouting across the store at her. No amount of pantomiming and mouthing of the words could get the point across to C, and Sandy apparently told her (we were all in the midst of Professionals-mania then), "Doyle would have known Bodie wanted him to pick up some broccoli with just a raise of his eyebrow!" or something like that. Hence, Bodie and Doyle would have passed the broccoli test. (Sandy, please correct my wrongness here!)And they do. The best pairings, for me, are ones who never have to explain what they want beyond a mere eyebrow-raise or a twitch of the head. Especially because I seem to be attracted to less and less talkative guys -- I've gone from the decidedly unchatty Lt. Castillo on Miami Vice to the churlish AD Skinner on X-Files to the nearly speechless Michael on La Femme Nikita to the taciturn pairing of Chris and Vin in Magnificent 7, culminating in the character who speaks 74 words through an entire two-hour movie, Sgt. Todd in Soldier. These days, I am liking the emotionally volatile but not especially loquacious Dominic Toretto. Spike is a freakish anomoly.
All of these guys pass the broccoli test with their (my) partner of choice. Dom merely looks at Brian after Jesse is killed in The Fast and the Furious, and Brian knows exactly what he wants him to do. After they finally get together and they know their true feelings, Michael can stare blankly at Nikita and she knows what he's telling her. In watching MV eps lately, it's amazing how much Castillo and Crockett say to each other without ever talking. And Chris and Vin... they were passing the broccoli test before they even met! The very first time they even see each other, they exchange a look across a wide street and nod their heads so slightly that if you're not watching carefully, you'd miss it, and then they go off to save a guy from being lynched! They've never even seen each other before. The uber-broccoli test masters, if you ask me.
Luke and Han, though, not so much. Nor Eddie and Monty, nor Angel and Buffy. For such a laconic guy, Angel with Buffy never had that broccoli test quality; though oddly, Spike and Buffy get very close frequently for reasons that mystify me, since Spike is so absurdly chatty and strange. Once he was on Buffy's side, they seemed to have a wierdly connected quality, especially in fighting. Maybe that's another reason why I hate the second half of season 6 so much -- they wrecked the broccoli test quality that Buffy and Spike had cultivated. Angel and Spike have no ability to pass the test at all, but it's charming because they try and we get great comic results. Angel and Wes, also, feint close to it, but never quite get there.
I'll often vid characters who can't pass the test, but I seem to have a tough time writing them -- the one thing that draws me most, a taciturn character paired with a chattier, more social one, is often just hated by most fans, who can't figure out how to write guys who don't talk. But for me that's a huge attraction -- I want that character to tilt his head slightly and the other character to go running off after bad guys. I want oceans of emotion to be conveyed with just a tiny quirk of the mouth. If they're on opposite ends of the produce aisle, I want one to know the other needs broccoli! Because that's the fun in writing in them, I suppose -- trying to convey that intangible quality yourself through words. So I guess there are many fannish loves, but only the most intense will pass the broccoli test, and only those who pass will drive me to write fanfic.
And now this is making me think of Dorinda's theory of clams, which I suppose I'll have to talk about in light of the broccoli test. Mmmmm. Clams and broccoli -- D, we should write an essay!
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 10:55 am (UTC)mulder/scully...definitely pass the broccoli test..
and XM movieverse wolverine/rogue...
(2 of my favorite fandoms)
:)
xo, a/nyc
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 10:55 am (UTC)The DVD versions are also different from the re-issues, apparently Han and Greedo now fire simultaneously, but I'll have to wait and see.
I did buy the Letterbox versions of the series before all the changes were made, but I'm wary of the new ones. I'll buy the set so I can have SW and Empire on DVD, I could care less about Jedi and everything that came after-wards. From what I hear, Jedi has had Jar Jar type creatures edited in to the Corusant sequence, and Hayden Christensen stuck in with Yoda and Obi-wan at the end. And I liked Tatooine better when it was an unpopulated, deserted backwater. Why did it have to morph into Busyville?
If Lucas ever revamps the series again, Tatooine will probably get a Starbucks.
Why, in God's name, can't Lucas just let things be. Sigh.
ETA - Interesting cultural note. The LJ spell-checker, while not recognizing "Starbucks", has suggested that I change "Obiwan" to "Obi-wan."
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 11:34 am (UTC)Incidentally, I think Spike and Buffy would pass the broccoli test. Spike may be chatty, but he's also essentially broody and uber-expressive with his minutest gestures. Especially when he's alone and longing after Buffy before the Scoobies will have anything to do with him. Lots of scenes where he goes in and we have total empathy with him just because we caught him mid-swig at the pub trying to get over his heartbreak.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 11:42 am (UTC)Pass the broccoli test:
Kirk/Spock (I'm sick of your half-breed interference, Mr. Spock!)
Stuart/Vince (It's all true! Everything we've been told!)
Seth/Sol (suspenders!)
Buffy/Spike (I'm with you on this one)
Sonny/Vinnie (yes, in another lifetime)
Starsky/Hutch (but of course)
Jeremiah/Kurdy (post-apocalyptic S&H)
Horatio/Archie (as much as Horatio ever could manage broccoli with anyone)
Johnny/Bruce (absolutely! I present "Zion" as my proof)
Alexander/Hephaistion (say no more)
CJ/Toby (sign language)
I even have a couple of icons that I subtitled "No words necessary," with pictures of my BSOs just looking at each other. And yet, how do I then explain Duncan/Methos? Because, so not, and they are my all-time OTP. And yet, the potential for broccoli is there, big time. Maybe it's the potential that keeps me coming back. :D
I remembered the story about Sandy and Bodie and Doyle and the broccoli, but it was still great to hear it again. *g*
the un-broccoli, or broccoflower, test
Date: 2004-09-21 03:03 pm (UTC)I know you're not a fan, but Mulder/Krycek, too (obviously) -- and probably even Aeryn and John on Farscape. As I got bored with slash stories that ended in the perfect fuck, I got a bit more interested in the imperfect fuck, which usually means the broccoflower couples, not the broccoli couples.
I think Spike and Buffy would pass it on some days; maybe it would only be one directional, though (and I might go either direction on different days!) or they'd be an aisle off and all angry about that. But that's part of why they're interesting to contemplate, even in bed.
Sigh. I'm hungry now. Great post.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 03:54 pm (UTC)It's one of a million reasons why Buffy/Angel just doesn't work, they both like it too much to keep silent on their troubles, so in the end, they'd just be building up all those frustrations and anger till it all explodes.
They're just too alike in all the bad ways, and too different in the good ways. If they ever got together again, I'd give them three weeks at most, they'd kill eachother after a month.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 05:10 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 05:12 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 05:16 pm (UTC)I think there's always an anomoly in the whole clam/broccoli thing. We have to have some pairing who violate our usual standards so that we can appreciate them more. ;-)
Re: the un-broccoli, or broccoflower, test
Date: 2004-09-21 05:19 pm (UTC)What I really don't get, though, is why. I mean, most of the ones you mentioned (except ick, Krycek) are hot, yet never made me want to write! I don't know why, either. Luke and Han especially appeals to me, yet I can't put pen to paper.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 05:23 pm (UTC)Much as I adore Buffy and Angel together, they just could never pass the test. They're both clams, and that's dangerous. ;-)
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 05:48 pm (UTC)Btw, we should catch up next week so that I can give you the copy of the BtVS pilot I made for you.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-21 07:08 pm (UTC)That's exactly why I can't bring myself to watch, let alone buy, the DVDs. Somehow, I need to get ahold of letterboxed tapes of the original versions (probably on eBay), but I'm boycotting Lucas and his stupid revisionist history. Gah.
no subject
Date: 2004-09-22 01:01 am (UTC)Really...? How'd I miss that? *g*
I'd actually like to see if Jeremiah and Kurdy could -- it would be funny if they couldn't.
It would be really funny, but I'm betting they could. :D For my exhibit A, I choose the scenes from Things Left Unsaid (heh, ironically) part I where they are working in tandem at Thunder Mountain to find out who stole the page from Simon's journal. For exhibit B, I present the "we're so married with kids" scene from Journeys End. Mutual love of chocolate Necco wafers and the "you tied me up/you stole my fish" scene from Interregnum I for supporting evidence. But most of all, the scene from State of the Union where Kurdy shows up at Jeremiah's front door at precisely the moment Jeremiah is telling Gina he wishes he would.
I think there's always an anomoly in the whole clam/broccoli thing.
That could be it. I think, too, that I saw the very end of HL before I ever saw the rest of the show, and Duncan and Methos were just starting to get there in the last episodes. Plus, I fell for the show watching Till Death -- the "we're so married and living together" episode. *g*
I really don't have the clam thing, though. I mean, I really don't. Clams are the anti-turn-on for me, so I think these are two separate (but for some, complementary) phenomena.
Test
Date: 2006-01-31 05:26 pm (UTC)Re: Test
Date: 2006-01-31 05:34 pm (UTC)S&H so wrote the book on broccoli tests.
Re: Test
Date: 2006-01-31 05:34 pm (UTC)S&H so wrote the book on broccoli tests.
no subject
Date: 2006-01-31 05:34 pm (UTC)And they never got it back, dammit. :P
no subject
Date: 2006-01-31 05:56 pm (UTC)And in that 7th season Methos-Joe episode whose name is escaping me at the moment (with Joe's daughter), Methos knew what Joe was doing all along, didn't he?
I did have a point somewhere... Oh, yes! Duncan and Methos. On the surface they don't appear to pass the broccoli test, but I still think it's there. Methos is much more perceptive than he lets on a lot of the time. It just isn't part of his... personality, to give things away so easily.
no subject
Date: 2006-01-31 08:43 pm (UTC)They interacted as if they were telepathic ---and didn't need no stinkin' Vulcan mind meld :)
no subject
Date: 2006-01-31 10:45 pm (UTC)Great concept!
no subject
Date: 2006-01-31 11:35 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-02-01 08:08 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-07-04 08:04 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-07-04 08:10 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-08 02:58 pm (UTC)...and oh, man, the broccoli test, unlike the Domestic!Scenario is something a few of my pairings might fail (though not, as you say, Spike and Buffy, weirdly and fabulously attuned as they were).
no subject
Date: 2007-01-08 03:01 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-09 05:23 am (UTC)Wooster might realize, three months after the fact, that when Jeeves raised his eyebrow like that, he meant that he wanted broccoli. Or not.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-27 09:04 pm (UTC)Exactly! XDDD I love how he always gets rid of/destroys whatever item of Bertie's that offended him just before Bertie gives in and tells him he can.
no subject
Date: 2007-04-15 09:31 pm (UTC)Jeeves/Wooster has total broccoli test pass-ability (not sure that's actually a word, but oh well!), as does S/H. Since i came here (in a very round about way) from a Good Omens something I feel it necessary to say that broccoli notwithstanding, Aziraphale will always take the perfect bottle of wine when meeting Crowley. And while Crowley will always know when Aziraphale wants broccoli, he'll always get green beans instead, just to be awkward.
plum.
no subject
Date: 2008-05-02 10:08 pm (UTC)*shows off icon* It took me forever to get the file size down to 40k.
Soldier Fanfic
Date: 2008-06-13 02:54 am (UTC)I totally agree with the "Broccoli" test... so very, very true.
Thanks for the story!
no subject
Date: 2008-08-01 03:56 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-05-10 05:05 pm (UTC)oh! one of my favorite characters of all time, who manages to convey a universe with a single growl into the throat mic. :)))
I'd never heard of the Broccoli Test but two of my favorite pairings definitely pass it: Starsky and Hutch, Fraser and RayK. I can't tell you how viddable they are as a result.