Those were the days
Jan. 17th, 2006 09:18 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
gwynLast night as I was browsing my friends page, I saw the news that Joan Martin had died, unexpectedly, and it hit me really hard. I knew Joan only in the most casual way, having met her at my first Escapade many years ago, where she was amused by my being the world's oldest/youngest Professionals fan (I had first watched the series when it was airing a couple months behind Britain's showings, on Canadian TV, but it took me 16 years to find other fans after the series had started migrating its way here through the organization of slash fans). She was one of what a lot of us refer to as the "mothers of fandom," and while there's a bit of a joke when we say that, it's very true. There are so many fans who've been around, organizing and pimping and sharing and creating, for so long, and most of them don't get their due now that fandom has exploded on the 'net and everyone coming in thinks they invented fandom, and don't care about any of the stuff that came before. Joan usually taught the writing workshops at Escapade those first years I was there, and though I didn't really have a lot to pick up, I went to a few of them because I thought she was an interesting person, and I really wanted to absorb the history from a lot of the people who came to that con year after year after year.
It made me think, too, of something that's really been eating at me lately and has left me feeling very bitter about fandom -- this sense of entitlement that most newer fans, those who've only known fandom on the net, have about everything: it's all free for the taking, they have to give nothing in return, grab grab grab, gripe gripe gripe when stuff doesn't go their way, and it's all about them because the world is theirs and we only live in it. When I first came into media fandom (as opposed to SF fandom, where I first came in through the doors of obsession), there were still a lot of people like Joan, who had been contributing for years. Sure, in the early days, there were people who plagiarized or stole, or were divas, or selfish, or whatever. Those folks will always be with us. But there were enough people whose main goal was to contribute and share that there was never a sense of unbalance. Because there were no interwebs back then, it was about face to face contact and mentoring, and community. I think we give a lot of lip service to the idea of community now, but it's mostly bullshit.
Case in point (and please keep in mind that I am ranting, because I am cranky and fed up and really hating a lot of people right now). Last year, I remember reading a post-Escapade con report that made my blood boil. Some whiny bitch I will not name was complaining about everything, but especially the vid show, where her vid looked terrible and it was all the vid show person's fault and the person running the vid show review panel (whom she couldn't even refer to by name, just kept calling her "this woman" over and over) sucked and didn't talk about enough vids (there had been technical snafus at the beginning of the panel, but you know, this happens, like, every year, so most of us laugh and shrug it off), and just gripe grip gripe in the meanest way possible. The person running the vid show panel ("this woman") had a name, Katharine, and Katharine is my friend, true, but I thought it was a pretty lousy way to disprespect her purposely. The whiner complained about *everything*, but never once offered up that maybe she could, you know, fucking volunteer to help out. And Katharine was learning, in a hurry and in a forced situation, how to put together a master disc of vids from dozens of different vidders and formats when she had never even vidded on a computer, so this was new to her, and so yeah, there are glitches (there were on mine, but I didn't whine about it because that's what happens -- shows are done by volunteers, who -- gasp! -- aren't perfect). We didn't have a choice about the projector or its washed-out video (and won't have again this year, it's what we have, so that's that). But it didn't stop Ms. Gripeypants from ranting and insulting my friend without ever once bothering to find out any of the details.
What was so offensive to me, besides the sense of entitlement Whiney Cow had, was that Katharine had been vidding since before this person had ever even heard of fandom, and has done more to create a vidding aesthetic that's carried through into some of the best vidders today than that woman could ever even dream of. But because she volunteered her time and effort and contributed to the community, she gets a big target painted on her back for whiny, self-absorbed pigs to shoot poison arrows at. It took everything in me not to leave a comment for the self-centered asshat about how maybe if she doesn't like things and thinks everyone is doing such terrible things solely to her, she could then pony up and volunteer her fucking time to make things go the way she wants them. Because, you know, she never would. People like that only ever gripe, they don't volunteer, they never offer their time. I didn't say anything in the end because Gripey McGripepants is, unfortunately, apparently friends with many of my own friends, so I left it.
And that entitlement thing has been driving me nuts pretty consistently since then. Last week I mentioned the unnecessary comment on a vid rec of one of my LFN vids that made me seethe (and still makes me seethe) about how the video source was "very poor quality" but that it shouldn't detract from watching the vid multiple times. WTF? My tapes (since tape is all there is for source of all 5 seasons, as Warner isn't exactly hurrying to put this show out on disc) aren't fabulous S-VHS quality but they are far from "very bad" and causing people harm to view them. But of course, everything these days is free and perfect pirated source from HDTV, right? Right? Only the most pristine need apply, apparently, to be considered a quality vid. Due to another rec for a vid, I have been fielding tons of password requests, which is like, "yay" until I realized that not one of those dozens and dozens of people who went to see the vid have said one single word to me about it. Not a thank you, ever. From over 50 people in the past couple days. Because... why would anyone thank you for the time and effort and extreme amount of money you paid out to host the vids and make them, and give them to the entitled for free? Why on earth would people who get everything free at others' expense as part of the community act of sharing ever say even a simple thank you? That would spoil the sense of entitlement!
(/cranky old fan ranting)
This seems, more and more, like what fandom has become. Larger and larger, and ever more disconnected and rude and thoughtless, and mostly selfish and self-centered. It's all about us: give us free stuff, perfect stuff, off your donated time and effort and money, and if there's the slightest tarnish to it, we will gripe and smear you on our LJs and talk as much nasty shit as we can. I do meet people, newer fans, who aren't like this, but they are more the exception than the rule now.
What makes me saddest of all is that so many of the fans for whom this was the rule, rather than an exception, are disappearing. They have drifted away for various reasons (sometimes just because it has become such an inhospitable place for oldsters), and we lose out on so much when they do. Not just history, but politeness, fannish manners and true community. So, I mourn Joan's passing not just because she was a good person who shared with a newbie at her first con away from home, but because she was representative of a time and a community when entitlement wasn't even a concept to most fans. Joan was the kind of fan who made fandom such a welcoming, communal place to be. It was never perfect, but it was like a family in that respect. I think many of us at Escapade this year are going to be pretty sad, and I know there will be some recognition of her there, because she was just that much of a presence. She volunteered and shared and gave to this community, and she will be sorely missed by those of us who got the chance to know her, and know that old part of fandom that seems to be disappearing.
It made me think, too, of something that's really been eating at me lately and has left me feeling very bitter about fandom -- this sense of entitlement that most newer fans, those who've only known fandom on the net, have about everything: it's all free for the taking, they have to give nothing in return, grab grab grab, gripe gripe gripe when stuff doesn't go their way, and it's all about them because the world is theirs and we only live in it. When I first came into media fandom (as opposed to SF fandom, where I first came in through the doors of obsession), there were still a lot of people like Joan, who had been contributing for years. Sure, in the early days, there were people who plagiarized or stole, or were divas, or selfish, or whatever. Those folks will always be with us. But there were enough people whose main goal was to contribute and share that there was never a sense of unbalance. Because there were no interwebs back then, it was about face to face contact and mentoring, and community. I think we give a lot of lip service to the idea of community now, but it's mostly bullshit.
Case in point (and please keep in mind that I am ranting, because I am cranky and fed up and really hating a lot of people right now). Last year, I remember reading a post-Escapade con report that made my blood boil. Some whiny bitch I will not name was complaining about everything, but especially the vid show, where her vid looked terrible and it was all the vid show person's fault and the person running the vid show review panel (whom she couldn't even refer to by name, just kept calling her "this woman" over and over) sucked and didn't talk about enough vids (there had been technical snafus at the beginning of the panel, but you know, this happens, like, every year, so most of us laugh and shrug it off), and just gripe grip gripe in the meanest way possible. The person running the vid show panel ("this woman") had a name, Katharine, and Katharine is my friend, true, but I thought it was a pretty lousy way to disprespect her purposely. The whiner complained about *everything*, but never once offered up that maybe she could, you know, fucking volunteer to help out. And Katharine was learning, in a hurry and in a forced situation, how to put together a master disc of vids from dozens of different vidders and formats when she had never even vidded on a computer, so this was new to her, and so yeah, there are glitches (there were on mine, but I didn't whine about it because that's what happens -- shows are done by volunteers, who -- gasp! -- aren't perfect). We didn't have a choice about the projector or its washed-out video (and won't have again this year, it's what we have, so that's that). But it didn't stop Ms. Gripeypants from ranting and insulting my friend without ever once bothering to find out any of the details.
What was so offensive to me, besides the sense of entitlement Whiney Cow had, was that Katharine had been vidding since before this person had ever even heard of fandom, and has done more to create a vidding aesthetic that's carried through into some of the best vidders today than that woman could ever even dream of. But because she volunteered her time and effort and contributed to the community, she gets a big target painted on her back for whiny, self-absorbed pigs to shoot poison arrows at. It took everything in me not to leave a comment for the self-centered asshat about how maybe if she doesn't like things and thinks everyone is doing such terrible things solely to her, she could then pony up and volunteer her fucking time to make things go the way she wants them. Because, you know, she never would. People like that only ever gripe, they don't volunteer, they never offer their time. I didn't say anything in the end because Gripey McGripepants is, unfortunately, apparently friends with many of my own friends, so I left it.
And that entitlement thing has been driving me nuts pretty consistently since then. Last week I mentioned the unnecessary comment on a vid rec of one of my LFN vids that made me seethe (and still makes me seethe) about how the video source was "very poor quality" but that it shouldn't detract from watching the vid multiple times. WTF? My tapes (since tape is all there is for source of all 5 seasons, as Warner isn't exactly hurrying to put this show out on disc) aren't fabulous S-VHS quality but they are far from "very bad" and causing people harm to view them. But of course, everything these days is free and perfect pirated source from HDTV, right? Right? Only the most pristine need apply, apparently, to be considered a quality vid. Due to another rec for a vid, I have been fielding tons of password requests, which is like, "yay" until I realized that not one of those dozens and dozens of people who went to see the vid have said one single word to me about it. Not a thank you, ever. From over 50 people in the past couple days. Because... why would anyone thank you for the time and effort and extreme amount of money you paid out to host the vids and make them, and give them to the entitled for free? Why on earth would people who get everything free at others' expense as part of the community act of sharing ever say even a simple thank you? That would spoil the sense of entitlement!
(/cranky old fan ranting)
This seems, more and more, like what fandom has become. Larger and larger, and ever more disconnected and rude and thoughtless, and mostly selfish and self-centered. It's all about us: give us free stuff, perfect stuff, off your donated time and effort and money, and if there's the slightest tarnish to it, we will gripe and smear you on our LJs and talk as much nasty shit as we can. I do meet people, newer fans, who aren't like this, but they are more the exception than the rule now.
What makes me saddest of all is that so many of the fans for whom this was the rule, rather than an exception, are disappearing. They have drifted away for various reasons (sometimes just because it has become such an inhospitable place for oldsters), and we lose out on so much when they do. Not just history, but politeness, fannish manners and true community. So, I mourn Joan's passing not just because she was a good person who shared with a newbie at her first con away from home, but because she was representative of a time and a community when entitlement wasn't even a concept to most fans. Joan was the kind of fan who made fandom such a welcoming, communal place to be. It was never perfect, but it was like a family in that respect. I think many of us at Escapade this year are going to be pretty sad, and I know there will be some recognition of her there, because she was just that much of a presence. She volunteered and shared and gave to this community, and she will be sorely missed by those of us who got the chance to know her, and know that old part of fandom that seems to be disappearing.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
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Date: 2006-01-17 06:25 pm (UTC)2) I haven't watched the vids yet! I am going to, I swear! And I will let you know! *g*
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:36 pm (UTC)It's the same reason that well over half the people who hit the vids site won't take the ten seconds to request the password. It's not immediate, it's not immediately free (they have to, you know, do something that requires ten seconds of their time), and they have to click maybe a thing or two extra. My god. The burdens.
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From: (Anonymous) - Date: 2006-01-30 11:31 am (UTC) - Expand(no subject)
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Date: 2006-01-17 06:37 pm (UTC)Me, I will continue to learn, share, write, and do art, despite how often fandom can hurt my feelings. What will probably happen is I will make smaller and smaller fannish circles for myself. Case in point: Dawn and I are talking about writing a 13th Warrior SERIES, and nobody will read it but us. That's just fine.
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:39 pm (UTC)BTW, if you let me know about your 13W story, or you publicize it, there are readers. Both Jo and Rachael, if you mention it this weekend, will be interested, I know that.
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Date: 2006-01-17 06:48 pm (UTC)I always wanted to go to Escapade, but never had the money (coming from Europe here) - I still don't have the money, so I'll mourn alone in my corner of the world...but yes. Joan did embodied a way of understanding fandom that si disappearing slowly. It is sad.
re: vids feedback. I have left some feedback here and there, but not always (to you and others) and I was planning to start watching a vid or two a day and write feedback for it. It certainly is no hardship. I do make a point of saying thank you, when I can, for vids and stories. Because I was mentored properly, and even without that, my mum taught me to say thank you.
/rambling
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:41 pm (UTC)Re the feedback, it's usually people on my flist who are kind enough to acknowledge vids and fic. It's just... a lot of strangers and total silence is ... maybe not a surprise, but a disappointment. Knowing that people really do suck as much as I think is sort of dispiriting thing. I'd rather be proven wrong.
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:28 pm (UTC)I don't know whether using someone's name is more or less disrespectful than using it, in different contexts I've found even people I assumed would feel similarly felt entirely different; there can be lots of reasons and variations in intent behind that choice, including just being hopeless at remembering people's names, or not knowing if it's OK to use a real first name or a fannish pseud to refer to someone.
Complex issues, these are. Easily hurtful, and painfully hurting.
And anyone who volunteers, who puts themselves out there, is wearing a target. It sucks, but it's true. Doesn't matter whether it's in person or online. Doesn't matter if it's for helping at a con, running a con, putting together a zine, or running a USENET group, mailing list, discussion forum or LJ community.
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:45 pm (UTC)To me, it's like voting -- if you don't vote, then shut the fuck up. You don't get to gripe about the government if you didn't do at least one small thing to stand up and say no to it (or yes, whatever the case may be). If people aren't going to volunteer to participate themselves, then they can shut up, or at least air their complaints with some kind of responsibility -- fill out suggestion forms, write a letter to the concom, try to communicate with the person they're complaining about. Instead of taking the backseat driver position, and letting everyone know how superior they are, while doing absolutely nothing to change the situation for what they believe is the better.
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Date: 2006-01-19 06:02 am (UTC)mmmp. might I propose a distinction? That it's rather anything you do that puts you out there, that is good, will always draw some negative. I don't think that you can be liked without being hated by some one else; the only way to be hated by no one is to never express your opinion.
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Date: 2006-01-17 07:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-17 10:26 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2006-01-17 08:16 pm (UTC)My therapist wants me out of fandom.
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Date: 2006-01-17 10:29 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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From:Oh, God, hinty people!
From:I hear this...
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Date: 2006-01-17 09:37 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-17 10:39 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2006-01-18 01:50 am (UTC)Seriously, consider it if you're unhappy. I was like a drug addict in recovery for 6 months, and then it was a whole lot easier. Cold turkey, man.
:-/
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Date: 2006-01-18 06:47 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-18 02:04 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-18 06:50 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-18 05:01 am (UTC)I have to say that:
that entitlement thing has been driving me nuts
Oh yeah. I'm just tired of fandom and fans, and rude people, and yeah, I know I'm not perfect, but I'm tired of feeling like the people who feel that I owe them something are sucking me dry. I'm tired of being sucked dry, and yeah, I don't expect all sunshine and rainbows, but on a community I run, there's 51 people. I am the only person (well myself and my writing partner) who write in this tiny little fandom, and yet, out of the 51 people there, two comment regularly. TWO. How sad is that?
And you know, I don't think they *owe* me comments, but neither do I owe them fic or vids, do I?
It's not just them, though. It's every aspect of my fannish life, I think.
Sorry, you're not the only bitter one. All I can say is... it makes me sad that it's come to this, for both of us.
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Date: 2006-01-18 06:55 pm (UTC)I think it's what you make of it, to a certain degree, but there's only so much effort you can put into making it a great place, and then have sand kicked in your face, before you give up and go home. I try to make it a good place with the care I put into fic and vids and spending money and time and effort to share them and pimp people in my LJ and such, but... to not get that in return, to not get much of anything in return, means that my efforts to make it the place I want to be are not successful. And so I wonder what that says about a lot of things, but it tells me that it's not what I need.
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Date: 2006-01-18 05:57 am (UTC)I too, have had a load of issues, so much so that some "fans" actually attacked me to the point of making me physically suffer. I turned away from that fandom--one I was extremely active in--purely for self-preservation.
I makes some of oldsters want to turn our backs completely and sit back and watch the newbies flounder, flail and fail.
Now don't get me wrong, not all newbies are like this, but such an overwhelming number are, it really tends to put me on the defensive from the onset. I hate to be that way, but I've been proved wrong too many times *not* to.
I am very sorry for you and the fandom's loss. It's always very sad to lose someone so dedicated and caring.
*hugs*
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Date: 2006-01-18 07:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-01-18 09:55 am (UTC)I agree with your rantyness; in fact, just this evening I read a review of a new book out about how rude everyone is nowadays and was mulling over my own checklist of Rudeness Hell, which is by no means limited to fandom (talking during movies being top of my list). But it's worse in fandom -- it affects us more, I think -- because this is where we want to spend time and enjoy ourselves. It's supposed to be the place we come to to get away from the Ordinary Rudeness of Real Life. And then we come here, and voila, it's just as rude, and that's a kick in the virtual nuts.
It's a bit harder for me, though, to blame the Evil Internet, because the fact is, I am a net fan. I never would have known about slash or media fandom without the Internet. And yet I know what you mean. I was a newbie net fan in 1994, which is a bit different from being a newbie net fan in 2006, but to be honest, I can remember fans decrying the Evil Internet and how it had brought to fandom the dirty and unwashed undesirables in 1994, and it's only within the past couple of years that I can let go of my own insecurity over my Internet pedigree to believe they're not talking about me when they're talking about how awful net fans are.
Yet, I *do* know what you mean. Because even though I was one of those dirty and unwashed raised-by-wolves net fans, some kind fans from pre-net days showed me unbelievable generosity back then. Of a staggering amount I don't think anyone would believe now, and for which I'm still not sure I adequately expressed my thanks.
More than tangible assets, though, their generosity constituted time spent, and trust given. Those are the things I feel are missing in a lot of fan interaction now, and those are the things I know that I'm holding back more and more. If a name unknown to me expresses a surprising interest in some obscure fandom I'm into, do I take the time to try to connect? Do I put my trust in them enough to check out their stories or vids? Most of the time, no, to be honest. We've all been fooled and burnt, we've all received blunt hostility, slaps in the face, or a wall of silence in return for time spent and trust given. So, I don't offer the time or the trust so readily anymore.
The feedback debate is going to annoy me for the rest of my years, I fear. I swear that out there there must be an Author Zero, the first one who never answered LOCs, and started the vicious cycle of "I never fb to authors I don't know/I never receive fb because readers won't write to authors they don't know". Some of the things said by the people who very kindly and generously have sent me LOCs really make me wonder if I have an ogre's reputation or if it's just fan writers in general. The most complimentary opening line is "I'm sure you have received a bunch of LOCs about this already, but..." I mean, I love that someone thinks that! Usually it's not true, but it's a compliment that someone would think that. Second of all, there is always room for one more LOC in an author's ego, believe you me. Don't believe Author Zero if she claims otherwise.
Anyway, yes. The rudeness and sense of entitlement suck, and make this an unfun place we come to to have fun.
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Date: 2006-01-18 07:27 pm (UTC)And I think it's a huge difference from when we were coming in, because we didn't think everything was our due. We paid for zines, we wrote LOCs, we had to go to cons to watch vids or buy tape collections. We contributed and the thinking was that expenses were shared -- it cost a lot to put out a vid collection, but we made it back through tape purchases at the minimum price. Now, the consumers believe it's their due to get it all for free, and the creators are the ones paying for it, but get absolutely nothing in return. Not even thanks.
The greed and selfishness to me is mind-boggling, and depressing, and enraging. I've often tried to be in the middle on the feedback debate -- those posts I've made about the practical aspects of it, or visual vicabularies, or whatever. But a simple thanks is totally outside that debate, I guess, and maybe that's at the core of what's upsetting me so much, and being reminded of what felt like better days, to me: GREED. It's just so effing greedy of people to take and then say things like, "LOL I never send fb I'm not good at it LOL" which is just a way of saying "I've built an excuse for my lazy selfish greedy bitchass punk self and here it is, you sucker."
I think people are taken advantage of in a way you never would be in real life (well, okay, except maybe in the workforce!) in fandom these days, in a way people didn't back in the earlier days. I was unwashed and raised by wolves when I met everyone, too -- 16 years of wandering in the wastelands by myself! -- and I don't know what I would have done if there hadn't been the mentoring and community I received. I don't think there's anything like that these days, and with so few people taught manners and simple common courtesy, it's just a free for all and a greedfest.
And I am afraid there's nothing we can do about it.
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Date: 2006-01-18 05:29 pm (UTC)2. Maygra proposed a feedback panel at escapade, so I hope some of the people who commented here might want to wander in and share some of their thoughts. Interesting discussion.
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Date: 2006-01-18 05:42 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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